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Thread: Edgar's Guide to Surviving Chief Attempts

  1. #1
    Tradesperson Edgar Figaro's Avatar
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    Default Edgar's Guide to Surviving Chief Attempts

    Kinda long, but a good read - even the experienced may learn something or two

    -Edgar's Guide to Surviving Chiefing-

    I've been lucky enough to be commanding not only mine, but entire battlegroups/alliances worth of armies since the first round of the first server in the US. Nothing is more gratifying than stealing an entire city, or 10 cities in one grab and really bringing down the enemy. Throughout my time though, I've learned through trial and error - as well as critical thinking on how to survive such an attack. One great insight to being a better coordinator, is to figure out what you would do to prevent what you are doing to others - and making sure that can't happen.

    This guide is how I've been foiled in my many coordinated attacks on taking cities. As well as my own methods that I've used to stop others from taking mine. It comes from 6 different full servers of experience as well as having the privilege of being able to over see 100's of chiefings in a variety of situations from alliances ranging from 7 wing METAs to 1 wing Elite squads.

    Finding the Chiefing

    Sometimes finding out if you are encountering a chief attack is difficult, most times it is easy, but all takes a bit of homework. If you are getting chiefed, you are getting chiefed by two methods. One person alone, or an alliance.

    One Person Alone- If one person alone is cheifing you. They'll do it either by single waves over and over again over time, or multiple waves from multiple cities all at once. If its a single wave, then it should be quite easy to stop, for unless they're right next door, you can eventually pool defense and rebuild your residence over and again to stop said chiefing. If it is in multiple waves, then likely, you have incomings from 2-3 different cities all landing in a short time frame. Make sure that when you are checking to see if you have multiple attacks from multiple cities, that you check each and every incoming wave from said person. It is becoming increasingly popular to change the names of all attacking cities to a single common name to mask such an attack.

    An Alliance- The same goes for the alliance. Except each person may only need to send 1 wave to do the trick, but from 2-3 different people. Again, any attack that has waves from 2-3 different people all landing in the same tight time frame should be considered an viable chief attempt. This becomes more serious if they do not look like catapult waves (5-10waves each person) but in sets of only 1, 2, or 3. Particular emphasis should be placed if the city with these type of attacks is the city with your main offensive army, for if it is taken - all those troops immediately are eliminated, regardless of where they are or what they are doing.

    Stopping the Chiefing


    Method 1# Brute Defense
    Fairly simple, have enough to stop the guy. Make sure you have a maxed out wall, especially when calling for alliance reins. Get the most bang for your buck. Keep troops well fed and be prepared to send them back when out of danger.

    Method #2
    Sniping
    This is like the common method to sniping catapults... and often requires less defense than having a whole alliance send reins to you (and less messy too). An attack will look like this

    Inc from A in 12:10:33
    Inc from B in 12:10:34
    Inc from C in 12:10 35

    Reins almost always come AFTER attacks.. so you want your reins to land at the :33 or :34 second of the attack to take the often less defended waves. 99% of the time in my expereince, most people send from 100-2000 troops as escorts meaning you only have to defend against that much. This is often much more manageable. Take a practice at reining one of your own cities one-two tiles away as practice to get a feel for lag on both your end and the servers. Again, remember that reins come after attacks in the grand order of operations, so landing on the same second as that first wave, prepares you for the 2nd wave coming the next second.

    Method #3 Bait and Switch
    A lot of inexperienced players (A lot 75% of all attempts in my experience) will go for the residence. So tear yours down, and build up a palace. If they scout you and see you have a palace, tear it down and build a residence. (Not every city with a palace is a capital). While you can't gold the construction of a residence or palace, you can gold the destruction of one. You can also catapult your own buildings if you have time. This works often, and buys you plenty of time.

    Method #4 - (Advanced) - Timed Construction
    Often, when being chiefed from multiple people or from one person from multiple cities at once. Only one wave has catapults. The rest do not. In that case, with some good math skills and quick thinking, you can DESTROY your own residence or palace, and then build it, setting it to finish between waves #2, and #3. Again, in my experience in the order of operations of Travian, attacks almost always land BEFORE construction orders complete, even in the same second. For simplicity sake an example

    Attack A: 12:10:59
    Attack B: 12:11:00
    Attack C: 12:11:01

    Attack A has catapults, Attack B,C does not. Destroy your residence, and set a level 1 to build so that it finishes at 12:11:00. So when that final chief wave does land... you have a residence, and they have no cats to destroy it. It takes some timing, but when figured right.. works like a charm and is just as effective as Method #2, or #3.

    Method #5 - (Expert) - Counter Attack

    This is one I schemed up on my own when a large alliance was going to chief 4-5 of my cities and made it very obvious to do so. Reins were already spread thin so I was pretty much on my own. They were known for sending in chiefs with their first wave - (as I'd say 80-85% of Travian folks do) and so I schemed this.

    It's a little known fact you can chief and lower loyalty in your own villages from any of your other villages. The trick here is to lower the loyalty of your village down to 2-10%, so that:

    Attack A: 12:10:59
    Attack B: 12:11:00
    Attack C: 12:11:01

    Attack A with the hammer and 2-3 chiefs takes your city! But Edgar?! We're trying to save my cities. No. At this point, you are destroying their hammer. When Attack A takes your city, it becomes a reinforcement to that village. You set YOUR Hammer to attack the city just taken from you @ 12:11:01 or even 12:11:00 for safely sake. Your hammer now attacks THEIR hammer in the city they just reinforced with no wall, and you get a Hammer on Hammer attack with no defensive bonus. One of the best situations you could hope for. If you wait a second or two, for an added kick, Attack B and C will run into the troops from Attack A and will do some damage and be completely destroyed by the giant hammer harassing you, before you go in there and clean it up. Now that he is down 4-5 chiefs and has no hammer, you can chief your village back at your leisure. A tad expsenive, but 100x less expensive than the guy that just lost 10k - 50k troops and 3-8 months build time because of your finesse move.

    A few added points

    Large Parties increase the percentage they lower your loyalty. You yourself running one negates that bonus, or gives YOU a bonus if they're not taking advantage of it.

    Romans can chief with 4-5 chiefs. Teutons and Gauls take 5-6. Meaning 3 waves, often.

    You can chief your own villages to rearrange where/how you use your expansion slots for optimal chiefing.

    A reiteration, almost always - the first wave is the only wave with catapults.

    Afterword
    Of course, this is just a guide. Things can change on the battlefield, and not every situation is as black and white as this guide - BUT this applies for 95% of the chiefings out there, from the most mediocre and newb of players, to how the best do it. Using a combination of most/all of these is the most full proof and efficient way to save your village and your hide. If you can muster the anvils the attacks head on, do it! Otherwise, take a lesson from the experienced and use these methods to keep your people loyal and your population fat.

    Regards
    ~Edgar Figaro
    Last edited by Edgar Figaro; 06-25-2009 at 12:38 AM.
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  2. #2
    Artisan WEB97's Avatar
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    GREAT guide!! Very useful!
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  3. #3
    Philosopher Greenman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar Figaro View Post
    You can chief your own villages to rearrange where/how you use your expansion slots for optimal chiefing.
    I didn't know that one!

    *goes off to chief his own villages*
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  4. #4
    Tradesperson Edgar Figaro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenman View Post
    I didn't know that one!

    *goes off to chief his own villages*
    Awesome. Standard chiefing rules apply though upon capture.

    Blacksmith, Armory and Academy research is lost.
    The wall is deleted.

    You won't however, suffer from the standard loss you normally get from chiefing villages from other people. (Those smaller than you)
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    Philosopher Greenman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar Figaro View Post
    Awesome. Standard chiefing rules apply though upon capture.

    Blacksmith, Armory and Academy research is lost.
    The wall is deleted.

    You won't however, suffer from the standard loss you normally get from chiefing villages from other people. (Those smaller than you)
    I think that most people would do this to keep the 3 chiefs open in the palace, right? That means chiefing villages previously chiefed... which would already have been affected by those rules.
    Last edited by Greenman; 06-25-2009 at 01:31 AM. Reason: moronic grammar :P
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  6. #6
    Tradesperson Edgar Figaro's Avatar
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    Correct. Or to free up a slot in a hammer village that may have founded a city via settlers early in the set. As long as it isn't a hammer city, or a anvil city - its usually well worth the cost. But aye, most frequently, to rearrange your all ready ill gotten gains so you can do it again.
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    *takes notes*

  8. #8
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    Your missing my favorite trick.......

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    Tradesperson piemaster102's Avatar
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    edgar, i amnot gonna lie, i dont like you but dis is one good guide, i am going to subscribe to this thread so i can pull this thing up later.
    "There is no such thing as a stupid questions, only stupid answers."

    -Piemaster103

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    JENOVA!!!!

    god damnit...i leave for a couple of days and you post THIS on the forums!!

    :P :P :P

  11. #11
    Philosopher Jekyll&Hyde's Avatar
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    Excellent guide.

    But darnit, how am I supposed to chief people now? Don't give out these secrets!

  12. #12
    Philosopher Greenman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BLAH View Post
    Your missing my favorite trick.......
    Yar? I'm listening...
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    thank you, learned some new stuff
    Forgive me, I am very bored

  14. #14
    Artisan azuremagician's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar Figaro View Post
    Method #3 Bait and Switch
    A lot of inexperienced players (A lot 75% of all attempts in my experience) will go for the residence. So tear yours down, and build up a palace. If they scout you and see you have a palace, tear it down and build a residence. (Not every city with a palace is a capital). While you can't gold the construction of a residence or palace, you can gold the destruction of one. You can also catapult your own buildings if you have time. This works often, and buys you plenty of time.
    Just keep in mind that if you cause the catapults to go random by switching out the residance for the palace, they still have a 1/39 chance of hitting the palace. I have never lost a village while using this trick, but it is possible.

    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar Figaro View Post
    Method #4 - (Advanced) - Timed Construction
    Often, when being chiefed from multiple people or from one person from multiple cities at once. Only one wave has catapults. The rest do not. In that case, with some good math skills and quick thinking, you can DESTROY your own residence or palace, and then build it, setting it to finish between waves #2, and #3. Again, in my experience in the order of operations of Travian, attacks almost always land BEFORE construction orders complete, even in the same second. For simplicity sake an example

    Attack A: 12:10:59
    Attack B: 12:11:00
    Attack C: 12:11:01

    Attack A has catapults, Attack B,C does not. Destroy your residence, and set a level 1 to build so that it finishes at 12:11:00. So when that final chief wave does land... you have a residence, and they have no cats to destroy it. It takes some timing, but when figured right.. works like a charm and is just as effective as Method #2, or #3.
    Something that I do is that I set the level of my main buildings at different levels. That way, If I have multiple chiefing attampts on 5+ villages simultaniously, I can use this timed construction on several of my villages.

    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar Figaro View Post
    Method #5 - (Expert) - Counter Attack
    It's a little known fact you can chief and lower loyalty in your own villages from any of your other villages. The trick here is to lower the loyalty of your village down to 2-10%, so that:

    Attack A: 12:10:59
    Attack B: 12:11:00
    Attack C: 12:11:01

    Attack A with the hammer and 2-3 chiefs takes your city! But Edgar?! We're trying to save my cities. No. At this point, you are destroying their hammer. When Attack A takes your city, it becomes a reinforcement to that village. You set YOUR Hammer to attack the city just taken from you @ 12:11:01 or even 12:11:00 for safely sake. Your hammer now attacks THEIR hammer in the city they just reinforced with no wall, and you get a Hammer on Hammer attack with no defensive bonus. One of the best situations you could hope for. If you wait a second or two, for an added kick, Attack B and C will run into the troops from Attack A and will do some damage and be completely destroyed by the giant hammer harassing you, before you go in there and clean it up. Now that he is down 4-5 chiefs and has no hammer, you can chief your village back at your leisure. A tad expsenive, but 100x less expensive than the guy that just lost 10k - 50k troops and 3-8 months build time because of your finesse move.
    Hmm, I've never had the oportunity to try this one. The one flaw that I see here is that this will only work for you feeder villages. I think we mentioned this before, but when a village is chiefed, you lose all of the research and troops that were trained there. So not only does this take skill and a good hammer to pull off, but you have to be careful on which village to use it on.


    All in all, this is a very well thought out guide.

  15. #15
    Customer Service Team retched's Avatar
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    Here's a question and it might have been answered ... or not.

    What if the village they are chiefing from is a capital with a palace or a village with two active chiefs coming from it?

    Do the chiefs double the loyalty lost in one wave or is no one that insane enough to lose over 90000 resources
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    each chief hits once. so two waves with one chief each works the same as one wave with two

  17. #17
    Tradesperson Edgar Figaro's Avatar
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    and if you build a palace from lv 0 - 20 without founding any villages.

    You can have 3 chiefs, in one wave.

    The uber players can even build the palace up to 20, build 3 chiefs.. tear it down... rinse and repeat in a different village... and build 3 more.. for a total of 6. As long as you never lose one, they work to their full ability. EXTREMELY costly, and in most situations unnecessary. But I've seen a guy do it..
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  18. #18
    Tradesperson bustrbladr77's Avatar
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    good guide, very well thought out.
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  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar Figaro View Post
    In that case, with some good math skills and quick thinking, you can DESTROY your own residence or palace, and then build it, setting it to finish between waves #2, and #3.
    You don't necessarily need to destroy your residence completely. In fact, it is better not to completely destroy it. That way the enemy cats will destroy your residence and not a random building. Your residence will still be completed on schedule and be at level 1 to prevent the chiefing.

    The enemy will be scratching his head if he sees:

    'Residence has been destroyed'

    and then in their next chief wave a second later he sees:

    'Residence has not yet been destroyed'

    I have personally pulled off this maneuver successfully.
    There are 2 counters:
    First is to this is to catapult the Main Building and the Residence. Destroying the Main Building should remove the residence from the build queue.
    Second is to send 2-3 cats with your Chief Waves to target the Residence.

  20. #20
    Tradesperson bustrbladr77's Avatar
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    A well-thought out, useful guide. this stirs joy in me heart it does. you outdid yourself Edgar because this guide helped me survive a chief. i used a variation of the 3rd way
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  21. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by drp View Post
    Destroying the Main Building should remove the residence from the build queue.
    ...why would it remove it? the MB isn't needed for building things.

  22. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fenix 3.0 View Post
    ...why would it remove it? the MB isn't needed for building things.
    Although the MB is a prereq to almost every building and technically "houses your workers" and etc, it wouldn't matter as the residence has already been queued up. It's the same concept as troops continuing to be built after your barracks has been catapulted and etc: once it's been ordered nothing can stop it but you.

    Good thinking, though.
    -Rowen

  23. #23

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    did you mean to quote me? cause i was saying that the construction would go on even if the MB was destroyed

  24. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fenix 3.0 View Post
    did you mean to quote me? cause i was saying that the construction would go on even if the MB was destroyed
    Yeah.
    -Rowen

  25. #25

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    Just stopping in to say Hi to Edgar :}

    Was awesome playing with you on my first travian server and hope that someday again we can team up

  26. #26

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    I'd like to request this thread be moved to the FAQ section, if that's possible. I've referred several people to it and think it'd be easier to find if it were in a section better designed for it.

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  27. #27

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    You forgot my personal favorite, zero their village they are cheifing from before it gets to you because you have a higher TS than they do!
    Quote Originally Posted by Briares View Post
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