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Thread: Travian.....for beginners? (Game)

  1. #41
    Philosopher elfuaso's Avatar
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    When everyone else got a rat for that one quest, travian gave me a fully developed 100% 15c with level 19 fields, a 75k hammer, and 15 villages.

    I guess travian knows how to treat royalty.
    -Chance is the only constant.

    Go *edit* yourself.

  2. #42
    Philosopher F.C.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baghernia View Post
    Maybe harsh but a max of 3-4 login ips?/what ever unique identifier Travian wants to use, To help combat excessive dualing?

    Sitting already adds a huge element to this game for vets.
    I kind of like the idea of limiting dualing and making players utilize the sitter feature. I don't know of many dual accounts that actually use it to be sat for, it's usually only to sit for somebody else that isn't playing on a dual account, or an account that lost all of the duals.

    Quote Originally Posted by Legionnaire67 View Post
    In short form, here's what I think you could do to get more newbies/retain more newbies:

    1. Advertising.
    1a. Give benefits to groups of people coming here.
    2. Supported method of mentoring with in-game benefits.
    2a. Figure out a way to restrict dualing.
    3. Newbie server would only be effective if you could keep a veteran from squeaking on there and wrecking havoc.
    I actually love this list.


    Quote Originally Posted by Legionnaire67 View Post
    It was the dueling that we had going on there, the personal alliance and the subsequent joining of PWNY (and the guys/gals who were involved in that first server of PWNY) that kept me in the game. I still talk to several of them and their willingness to actually help a newer player understand the concepts of the game went a long way towards getting me to keep playing (and spending gold.)
    Not only did PWNY have great members willing to teach anybody who joined that was willing to learn, but when we opened up MyLilPWNY we got over a handful of new recruits that graduated into the main part that not only learned the game, but they played great once they learned. As a result several of them came back for the next round and even another round or two with us. They continued to learn and play and get better. That training wing, and all of the players willing to learn that we let into the main wing, really did great and kept coming back which I am proud of. I think that is contributed to two main things; the first being that our veteran players were not only great players but they also had the ability to teach the game extremely well and were willing to teach, and the second being that our recruiting method was so strict that we always got great recruits. We weren't necessarily looking for the best player, we always were looking for the player that we either knew through connections or neighbors or somebody we knew would play great as a team, no matter what their experience. That way of recruiting, and the ability to teach recruits really was extremely successful.

    Quote Originally Posted by Legionnaire67 View Post
    1a. As a subset of advertising, FC asked if there was a real way to draw a group of people. One potential way would be to allow them to put in a specific "code" upon creation which would either give them something (item? rez?) or put them near their friends when they're starting. This would give incentive to actually tell your WoW guild about it or your online MW2 friends. As it stands right now, you MIGHT be close to your friends but probably not within a distance where you'll be able to do any real assisting.
    Advertising definitely is key. I hope that once the bugs are worked out with T4 that instead of investing more money into developing the game or changing it drastically, that a good portion is put back into advertising.

    This is a great start for the idea of getting groups to come or getting people to invite more players. Right now we have the invite a player for gold feature, but that really isn't used too much. Advertising campaigns on gaming sites that offered better rewards (whether it is more gold, a free gold club, a certain amount of Travian plus time added per person, or resources) really would be a great way for groups to come over and to get people to spread Travian more by word of mouth.

    Quote Originally Posted by Legionnaire67 View Post
    2. One suggestion for such a system would be to get resources or something of that nature for being a mentor. Restrict who you can mentor as being only villas within X of your spawn, giving you a reason not to catapult that newbie who shows up. Mentor/trainee status would be like being a sitter, with a mutual X that can be clicked to remove them (and their benefits) from your account. This would be followed by a message that would appear right when you logged in stating "Bob has removed you as their mentor" so you're not caught with your pants down. As some measure of security for both trainee and mentor, they shouldn't be able to attack each other until Y number of days AFTER removing mentoring status.
    I like this, especially the idea of being within X of your spawn. It requires a vet to take advantage of the mentor system by making a friend nearby. Which I believe is much better than doing it with someone across the map. That way they are forced to not only share mentoring ideas, but they have the location to actually help each other when needed with defense/resources/etc.

    I also like that it's a formal thing, like a sitter. One problem is if people tried to take advantage of it by spawning in the same 7x7 and claiming to mentor each other to get the rewards. I think the account being mentored should be smaller, otherwise the mentor wouldn't receive any rewards. I guess it would be harder for friends to spawn near each other if the random spawning idea was set up as well.


    Quote Originally Posted by Legionnaire67 View Post
    2a. Limiting dualing in some way would also go a long way towards helping new players. Not sure how, or IF, this should be done but Baghernia is right. Dual/triple accounts rule the servers, simple as that. I would be willing to wager that at least 9/10 of the top 10 accounts on most servers are dual, if not triple or quad, accounts.

    Vets won't like this, I know I wouldn't and I cringe at even lending another "Aye" to Baghernia's argument. However, veterans are not the future of this game. We're a cranky, *****y bunch who tend to feel it's our right to continue to play the game how we played it 2 years ago and when you change it and force us to adjust our strategy, we threaten to quit (and some actually do) but our style of gameplay really does hamper TG getting new players. I wouldn't cater to the veterans more than you have to.
    I completely agree with all of this. The idea is great, I actually get more pride in my account when I play on an account with fewer people. Alone, or with one dual, I feel like the account is mine and the rankings and stats and account itself all reflect myself as an individual player. Yeah dualing makes for a much more active and better account, but it definitely is completely unbalanced. It's like if you are playing a football or basketball game and there is one guy against 3 or 4. Sure the one guy has a chance, even more if he is really good, but chances are the team with 3 or 4 people will win.

    One thing to think about, even though we aren't developers, is how? How would you limit dualing? It is difficult to limit IPs since so many of us end up having different IPs. But with all of the technology and brains out there, there has to be a reasonable way to do it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Legionnaire67 View Post
    3. A newbie server would only really work if you can reliably keep people like Nailzz off the server. Just ONE person like that getting loose on a server would result in a cluster<explicit> of immense proportions and decimate the newbie population.

    The only reliable way I can think of (note, I'm not a programmer!) of doing this would be to have people have one account where all of their servers go through. Only allow one account, period, and that account can only access a newbie server once. Anyone found to have more than one account, well, figure something out to do to them but it'll need to be sufficiently nasty to keep people from wanting to do it.
    This is an idea that has been brought up before and discussed in-depth in the ideas section. (I will attempt to find the thread(s) about it later, I remember making a post in there myself.) And is a great idea. It could also be a way to limit dualing if there is one main account to log in to separate servers. It could also deter cheating because if someone cheats on one of their servers, they could be easily checked to see if they are doing the same on other servers and punish them across their servers. Though that may be a bit harsh.

    Quote Originally Posted by Legionnaire67 View Post
    In the end, I think that vets are the root and core of the problem with retaining new players. There simply is not enough reason to be nice to new people in the game. Frankly, it is more beneficial to NOT be friendly to them (at least in the short term) than it is to ever be friendly. Something has to be done to make it worthwhile for vets to want to help people in order to get that attitude changed.
    This is exactly how I feel. Worded perfectly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nacho View Post
    This wasn't a terribly well thought out idea. Basically, I was picturing someone who would be available to mentor people in that alliance. In my vague, vague, picture, I see an extra option for the founder of a new alliance "apply for alliance advisor" where when you click that it would take you to a screen giving you more information about the details. I'm not real sure what the details would be, probably a bunch of generic pointing you to good resources in the beginning, and some answering of newb questions. Seems like it would be a good bit of work in the beginning, but eventually you'd be able to amass enough good sources that you wouldn't need to write individual replies for everything, you could just point them to what someone else wrote. I don't really know. My original idea was to somehow encourage experienced players to join and probably lead those newb alliances, but that seemed extremely impractical, and so it got scaled back to just them sharing knowledge without investing gameplay time too. But yeah, the mechanism needs a lot of work before it would be a well formed idea.
    It's definitely a start. It started out with an idea of one or two sentences, now it's a full paragraph. That is what this thread is for. I don't expect everyone to come in here with already coded and published plans. It's a place to ramble about ideas, because even in 40 paragraphs of rambling off ideas there may be one key sentence, or even word there, that ends up being picked up and built off of and expanded into something great.

    This official alliance advisor sounds similar to the player to player mentoring idea talked about a bit above in this post. Although rather than it being one player advising a single other player it is one player advising a whole alliance. Each idea has its merits and each could be expanded on to grow into a solid idea. As I said earlier with (MyLil)PWNY, the people in there that were great at the game and great at teaching helped many people grow into great players. Granted there were several of these alliance advisor types in the single alliance, but at the same time we know having an advisor, or many, works.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nacho View Post
    True, true. One of TG's other games - imperion - has an interesting take on this, where your first colony is in an entirely separate galaxy that other players can't get to. Then as part of the quest system, you get your second colony in a matter of hours, which should be in the galaxy with everyone else. I like the idea, but it's incredibly difficult to see how that could be transplanted into Travian without basically turning it into another game.
    That's actually a good idea, although like you said I'm not sure how well that would work when applied to Travian or how drastically it could change the game. But it does show somewhat that TG may have been thinking of ways to help out new players a bit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nacho View Post
    But I agree 100% that letting people know about the forums is needed. Maybe forum registration could be added as one of the quests? Though that raises the issue of lots of people registering with their IGNs, which isn't exactly ideal either.
    I like how now, once you finish the first 20ish main quests, it gives you a list of quests to finish at will. There could possibly be a quest where you register for the forums. Or if you already have a forum account you enter in the name or account id or something. Or when you sign up on the forums the first time you get an e-mail with a confirmation number that you are told to save for future Travian servers when you get to that quest, and you enter that confirmation number in.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ms. Evil View Post
    The way to do that is to somewhat restrict major hammer building by limiting troops. Yes, I just suggested a sim server. Then you can place support people on accounts in game that are there as alliance leaders. They train others and play some, but they get free gold for their real servers, help players, and teach them how to work together as a team. Make the server 2x like others have said and make it only last 1 month. Release artifacts in week 3 and the alliance with the most wins.

    With this it would have the same basic components and I don't think much would have to be done in terms of programing. The limiting troops may be tricky and could be skipped. But the only modification would be that end game changes (but it uses things already written so the change wouldn't be huge).

    Have one newbie server per domain. It would reset every 4-6 weeks. Hell, even take cats out of it. Then you wouldn't have to restrict it to just new people. You know that vets will want to play and get on anyways. They will find a way.

    IDK, I'm rambling. This probably didn't make sense.

    Thron had a good idea for a travian light server. Thron, come share it.
    You never second guess yourself when you're playing around and instigating people on the forums. But when you have a genuinely good idea you do second guess yourself. :P Don't try to play off your good ideas with "I'm rambling so this doesn't make sense." Face it eBol, it made sense and it was a good idea!

    I like skipping the whole WW thing, maybe there could be a WW running by the Natars at the end so new players can see what that looks like. This WW could be set to be completed at a certain time, then like you said, the alliance with the most artifacts would win. I like that this would have a set time, would not be an extremely long server, but still has a goal for the new players to accomplish besides just learning the game.

    Restricting hammer sizes and removing cats is an interesting idea. I think the cats would have to be there though to help players learn how to use those properly and get familiar with them. They also add a dynamic to the game that they should be used to when going on to regular server. However, restricting hammer size in terms of the number of cats and rams and troops may be a good idea to restrict the amount of damage done to players and the amount of destruction that can be done in general.

    I'd like to hear/see Thron's idea. Thronodor. Maybe he searches his name while lurking and that will get his attention.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nacho View Post
    Simplistic gameplay, defensive adjustments (double crannies (so 4x for gaul), increased defensive bonuses, start with a zoo, etc) and very tight rally point limits (for attacks, not reins), combined with extremely strict rules regarding ******tery, with more staff and mentors placed there. Or heck, maybe just "no cats" would do the trick. Basically, any method where you try to technologically keep people to one account there won't work. You need to change the incentives/gameplay so that it's not any fun for the bullies.
    For a beginners server aspects that would make it easier for new players to protect themselves from being farmed and allow them to have more time and room to grow and learn the game before being farmed a bunch is good. I like the double cranny idea the most. Starting with some oasis animals could also be a good idea, or at least giving more cages on adventures so it's easier for players to get more oasis animals for defense. But I also agree with Baghernia that you can't have too many of these protections otherwise it does change the type of player they turn in to, and we are still trying to get people to learn the game to grow into more aggressive players.

    Quote Originally Posted by xFios View Post
    I think what would be a better way would be a more sort of newbie server you could have like a two-phase servers, like in the first phase the player is introduced only to like a 13x13 map and there is a support or someone to help them. There could also be like Natar villages for the player to farm and to make it easy the Natar villages could only attack when the player was on.

    Then after the player has gone through like all the quests and stuff and basically learned the steps to the game, they are released into another server, where other players also play but this is basically still a newbie server. The server would be shorter and personally I don't think the no siege is good.... your taking out part of the game. And so to basically determine who wins in the end is the player with the best overall ranking, the player's average of Pop, Attack, and Defense.

    Oh yeah, and in the newbie servers no one can spend any gold, gold abusers usually force many early players to delete
    I have so many quotes, but there are so many posts I want to address. I guess I should reply sooner each time. :P

    Anyway, maybe something could be done where only one player spawns per 7x7. And you can't attack outside of that 7x7 until after you get so far, or a certain time has passed in the round. It's basically what you said, except on a smaller map and you're already on the map that you'll play on the whole game, you just can't attack outside of it. Also, like you said, there would be plenty of Natars to farm in the area as well.

    In general, if Travian spawned more Natar villages that grew faster and had better production (maybe with slightly more defense) then there may be less new players farmed early on if veterans could turn to Natars for reliable raiding sources. The new players could also turn to them as well to farm instead of not farming at all or being afraid to attack someone larger than them.

    I'm not sure about the no gold though. TG may not like that as it limits revenue being made and gold is a somewhat important factor in every server.

    Quote Originally Posted by Probability Indigo View Post
    What might be interesting is to find the ages of the people who stick around. I would be willing to bet that the majority are over 20. In my long career on travian I have rarely run into anybody my own age that is a continuous player. Once they have found the age factor it might be good to target ads to that age group.
    Travian should definitely be targeted to a gaming group of older teens (18/19) and up. Although I started playing Travian when I was 13. I guess I just have a lot of stubbornness and a sort of charisma in me that kept me coming back and making friends which also kept me coming back. I believe that the majority of Travian players are between 18 and 25 though. But that is just the most rough estimate ever made.

    Quote Originally Posted by MokMonster View Post
    That's why I liked Wren's idea (which I can't find) of having a newbie server.
    I really wish we could find that. Do you have any ideas of where it might be? When it might have been posted? Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by MokMonster View Post
    1 - restrictions on farming frequency - you can only hit someone once every ~2 hours and no more than 5 times in a 24-hr period.
    2 - cats don't do permanent damage - buildings should regenerate over a 12-24 hr period. This lets folks experience the devastation of war's effects, w/out the total frustration and deletion that a real catting causes.
    3 - no ribbons - equals no bragging rights over the server.
    Those are some of my favorite ideas yet. I really want to see this thread. I especially like the ideas of no ribbons. The ribbons and knowing how much you raided all contribute to people trying to raid more, raid harder, etc. People want to break records and be on top, but that's not as easy to do when that information isn't available 24/7. It takes some of the edge and pressure off of super raiding.

    Quote Originally Posted by MokMonster View Post
    4 - the MH and/or APs (appointed mentors) can graduate (kick) someone from a server. If a player clearly knows what he's doing, he doesn't belong there. Get rid of them. They're only hurting the learning experience if they're that far beyond everyone else. When everyone on the server is still struggling to figure out the basics, and 1 guy has 4 villages and cats, he doesn't need to be there. His apprenticeship is done, and he's booted.
    This is also a good idea. The player may not like it, but it's for the better of that server and all the new players. And the player would benefit from being able to learn in the regular server setting. New players would have to be warned that this is a possibility if they end up catching on quickly and growing fast.

    *wipes sweat off forehead* That was long, sorry, but I really really like where this thread is going and the ideas and discussion coming out of it. I don't usually make tl;dr, but this is a topic I am very curious and enthusiastic about and am very pleased that you all are participating! Thank you!
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  3. #43
    Philosopher MokMonster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by F.C. View Post
    This is also a good idea. The player may not like it, but it's for the better of that server and all the new players. And the player would benefit from being able to learn in the regular server setting. New players would have to be warned that this is a possibility if they end up catching on quickly and growing fast.
    Mostly I see it as a way of kicking off the experts who are there to torment the newbs.
    I doubt many genuine newbs will truly be force-graduated from a training server in this manner.

    I really want to see this thread.
    Me too.
    I went through the entire ideas section the other day and couldn't find it.
    There was a period where Wren posted like 6 ideas all at w/in a day or 3, and that was (so I thought) one of them.
    I did find a thread of his where he pointed at some of his others, but *this* one wasn't in there, nor were a few others I thought he'd created around the same time. I'll look for that post again later and post it here.
    MokMonster does not support, condone or agree with anything written in this post.
    Any suggestions to the contrary are purely unintentional.
    (Unless you agreed with it -- then I totally said it)

  4. #44

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    I joined three years ago; a coworker wanted to show me an example of a game doing a good job making money through microtransactions (I worked at a gaming company, and we were having internal flamewars over business model).

    He was already in an alliance, so through him I was able to find an alliance and mentors.

    I think there are two big things that need to be done to keep people:
    1) Make it easier to get decent. This game is frankly hard for a new player, especially one who spawns a month in, so that they're starting way smaller than established players. Anything you can do to help get over the initial "what do I do?" and to hook people up with a team will help.
    a) The manual sucks. Write a more complete one, and link to guides for how to play.
    b) Make it clear to people that the key to success is _teamwork_. Join an alliance, and you both have people helping you get better, and people depending on you, which gives you a reason to come back when something bad happens.
    c) Make it more useful for alliances to recruit a mix of folks. I'm not sure how to do this without causing mega-zerg-alliances that overwhelm a server, but... If an elite alliance takes on a few dozen 3-village-noobs, that doesn't help them very much, but it does cause those few dozen noobs to come back next round.
    2) Stop the culture of crushing noobs. A _lot_ of established people are fundamentally griefers, bragging about how many targets they've forced to delete. I'm not immune to this, my alliance hasn't been immune to this, but... Every time an experienced hard-core raider forces someone to delete, that's a player gone. Probably for good, since being crushed that hard means that you probably aren't coming back.
    a) The game (at least as of T3.6, I haven't tried 4.0) heavily rewarded hitting people straight out of beginner's protection. Good raiders kept a list of when people within 50 fields of them came out of BP, and had a raid on the way within minutes. That kind of trial by fire isn't a very fun experience for the recipient, and probably causes a lot of the player loss.
    b) The game doesn't have very good pull-from-behind mechanics. One month in, if I'm larger than you are, I'm probably going to stay that way unless I burn out (and yes, a lot of early heavy raiders do). Larger account == more raiders to send out + more cities building my own resources + more cities producing CP == I'm also growing faster than you, building new cities and new raiders faster. So, barring disaster, I not only stay bigger than you, the gap only gets wider, until at the end it gets trivial for me to cat you into oblivion.
    I) The two existing pull-from-behind mechanics are the combat "morale bonus" you get when someone larger attacks you, and the fact that CP needed for a city gets larger based on how many cities you have. But both of these are mild; in practice, I don't know of anyone ever saying "I shouldn't attack him, he's small enough to get a morale bonus", and since each of my cities produces CP, the CP ramp isn't bad -- as I build more cities, my CP income is going up roughly in tandem with my CP requirements.
    II) Examples of other pull-from-behind mechanics you could implement: a cranny bonus when raided by someone larger. This would encourage large folks to hit medium sized folks, leaving small folks as targets for medium folks, since a large person hitting a small person wouldn't get much. Or the much-hated-by-raiders "limit to how many raids you can have going at once" proposed for T3.something -- again, it means the huge mega-raider starts prioritizing farms, and leaving the smallest ones, which means the one-notch-down raider still has some targets available.
    III) Artifacts hurt the game. (again note: I've played T3.x, haven't tried 4.0 yet) Artifacts are a "leaders get further ahead" mechanic -- you have to be a big/strong account to get one, and what does it do? It makes you bigger/stronger. Alliances that aren't big enough to grab them are toast; when my troops are training at double speed and eating half wheat and yours aren't, your days are numbered. So... Something that democratizes artifacts. Make more low-end ones, so they can spread further beyond the big accounts (so, instead of unique/large/small, add a fourth tier "micro". Still count micros against your three-per-account limit; now they're not doing anything useful for the big accounts, who are already getting a decent selection of the existing ones. Make them like half-strength or quarter-strength smalls (so instead of a village 1/2 wheat consumption, it's a village 3/4 or even 7/8 wheat consumption), and make them spawn much further out, so they're easier for alliances doing the boonies thing to grab.

  5. #45
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    Limiting IP will not work. Through IP hiders, proxys, false geolocation and whatnot there'll always be a workaround to fill an account to the brim with duals.

    Limiting the number of farms will do some but will not solve the problem with duals going 24/7.

    But - Limiting the number of daily raids will solve the problem effectively. That way it matters much less how many duals an account has, and it almost eliminates the problem with 24/7 accounts as one gamer easily can send the limited raids during normal hours.

    This I say as an 'abuser' of the dual system; which is a colossal advantage once you find your dream mate/team. But I'd much rather have a more balanced and fair system, and I firmly believe such a system would have a lot more newcomers stay with Travian.

    Limited number of raids. That's the solution ingame.

    As for the forum ... I have to laugh out loud. Just take a look at the numbers of active posters contra active gamers. And it's even worse than that since several mass posters don't even play the game anymore. On Travian forum you either grow thick skin, or a brown nose combined with a hairy tongue, or you run away screaming at the top of your lungs - likely also leaving the game too. I do not propose a solution to that problem, but don't think forum can be used to make newcomers feel better about the game. For many it takes conditioning big time before the forum becomes a love affair.
    Last edited by Erazer; 07-13-2011 at 10:16 PM.

  6. #46

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    What if they restricted the distance you could travel to settle your second city? It would stop players from moving out to the boonies where late starters spawn and give them more of a chance to live.

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    travian should take some lessons from astroempire, they have mentors and there quest help you get a base(second village)
    mentors don't get anything for it just helping people.there is no dauls if they find people ips across the world your account is banned for couple of days.

  8. #48

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    My first experience with travian was not so fun... It was on US1. My friend's internet died thanks to a black out in his area, so he calls me and gives me instructions of what to do. So I sent multiple raids and build his villages up for around 3-4 days until he got his internet back. He called me every day to make sure no troops were dying and most of the time I have no idea what in the world I was doing except clicking a few buttons. Travian looked boring as hell for me.

    When US8 opened (with TNT) he starts playing in that server. Again, I was his go-to guy for a while until I was fed up and made my own account like a couple weeks before artifacts spawned. Starting from scratch was a whole different playing field for me and it was fun trying to figure out what is the best way to settle, what was so special about 15 croppers, and what the heck rams were for. I ended up building a small cap hammer and phalanxes all over the place until TNT and CSM decided to make some farms... I was wheat-locked, chiefed and utterly defenseless. The best part of it was, this player from Edmonton (Go Canada Go!) was teaching me how to get out of wheat-lock, how to snipe his chiefs and which troops I should be building. He even offered for me to join him on his solo account. But, I ended up jumping on my friend's account for a while until US2 started and I decided to attempt to play a proper round.

    US8 hooked me because of all the nice people around me, friend or foe... I wish I remembered your IGN, but thank you!
    s2r3: Yut BREW http://www.travian-reports.net/us/report/39892018468
    s3r3: Aerworn Nemesis
    s6r3: Puzzle RTA https://picasaweb.google.com/1178092...57285728149474
    s3r4: Mako GOB
    s6r4: Karma THC - a female dominated alliance - http://travian-reports.net/us/report/189640907c6 work horse hammer

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    I've thought up a few more things. This reply probably won't be nearly as long as my first one... then again, maybe it will.

    There seem to be 2 contradictory ideas for helping keep more new players in the game. One is to discourage metas (which tend to claim their territory, protect it, and cat everyone else), in favour of making people work with whoever is around them instead. The other is to try and bring in groups of people together, hoping that if they join with friends they are more likely to stick around.

    The problem is, if you implement a group function so friends (new to the game) can settle together, you also enable people in preformed alliances to settle together instead of forcing them to spread out and make new friends. If you implement random spawns, 3 new friends joining at the same time may not have any in-game interaction at all. (I think choosing quad *should* be removed, regardless, to help solve this problem... random spawns over the entire 801x801 map may also still be a good idea to consider in version T4.1 or beyond).

    About limiting daily raids... I think that changes the game WAY too much, and picking a number for a limit would be anyone's best guess.

    About bringing back rally point restrictions... I have no real opinion. However, I think the new rally point (20+ troops for fakes now required) changed the game way too much already. Fakes are hard to do, and most people in an alliance won't fake anymore, leaving real attacks too obvious.

    About the mentor system... it might be something to develop for future versions. It would take a lot of development and research to make sure it's useful, balanced, and won't be abused though.

    About a newbie server... could be very useful. I don't think cats should be removed. Again, a lot of development would be required to make sure it's balanced and won't be abused. One of the first mentions of a newbie server said something like a 6-week server with arti's out at 4 weeks. I'd recommend 2 constantly running newbie servers... offset 3 weeks each. Once one hits 3 weeks, new registrants are entered into the other server (which will just be beginning), for the next 3 weeks. Arti's (or something similar... maybe just "gems" to be taken from Natars) out at 3 or 4 weeks. Maybe Natars start building a WW at 5 weeks, and finish it within 5-6 days (leaving 1-2 days to reset the server)... or maybe WW's aren't needed at all on this server. Most "gems" in an alliance when the round is over wins. It's been mentioned to run the newbie server as 2x... I'd recommend using what's already available... run it 3x. Or, if 3 weeks isn't enough time for newbies to build at least 2-4 villages and get enough troops to attack Natars, then maybe run it 5x. The only problem is that players coming from a newbie server to a normal server won't like waiting for build times.

    About the forum... I have very little to say. But I do agree with what someone said about the rep and rank systems. They are a "game" in and of themselves. And if a noob comes into the community, they can get "catted" into nothingness too easily. Put everyone back on an even playing field (except staff, mods, and maybe teals as a way to show a little deserved distinction), and don't be afraid to hit a 1000+ poster with a ban if they treat a noob like a mutt.

    Finally, I have one more comparison. After one round ended last year, an alliance member suggested we go play a different game for the 1-2 months while waiting for the same server here to restart (that's how long the server of that game would last). In many aspects, the game was very similar to Travian. It was a war game. Many people sat back and simmed. Alliances were needed to accomplish much. But after that round was done, I had no desire to stick around and play another (and if I wasn't stubborn, I would have even deleted before the round was done).

    There's 2 main reasons I didn't stick around. I had no one take interest in me, so I was all alone. But more importantly, when I tried to look things up and find guides, answers, and recommendations, I could hardly ever find what I wanted. If I may be honest, answers.travian.us still needs a LOT of work before it's useful. I've been around here for years, spent time on forums, in guides, on help.travian.us, on kirilloid, and I *still* think answers.travian.us is (mostly) useless after trying to use it for the last few months. Someone earlier mentioned the same thing, but I think it got overlooked. Now, help.travian.us wasn't perfect, but it sure was better than the current option. "Answers" is slow to load (granted, similar to most of T4), not user-friendly (flipping pages to read about similar things doesn't work... you have to start back at the beginning), and hard to find anything other than a few basic things. But at least it looks cool. Also, this: http://forum.travian.us/showthread.p...le-of-Contents should be the first thing people see when they come to the forum. It needs to be more prominent, easier to find, and updated regularly (both this post, as well as all things linked in it). The good guides keep getting lost as new guides keep getting added and stickied everywhere. This table of contents can point people to exactly what they want/need, almost every time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Baghernia View Post
    Not true, there will always be people at the top, where is the cut off, the fact that the server close is sufficient.
    No, I understand there will always be top players - by the nature of the game, there simply has to be a #1.
    But there's a difference between a guy who is #1 and a guy who is larger than the next 3 people put together.
    Nothing is wrong with being #1. But if you're on a newb server and you're 2x or 3x times bigger than the next guy, then the odds are probably 10000:1 that you've played before... at least 1 full round. So the MH/Mentor folks should have the ability to remove those players. The only thing they're doing is hurting the experience for everyone else. In the tiny chance the guy is genuinely new (and just read and put into action all the guides, etc.), he's already learned all the tutorial server could teach him anyway, so ejecting him into the real world is for his benefit as well -- before he learns bad habits like "eh, I dodge cats, my buildings'll grow back" or whatever.


    For the folks talking about adding raiding restrictions for how many times you can hit a player in xx period -- that was an idea put forth for a newbie server, not a real one.
    1 - even if I can only hit a farm 5 times a day, that doesn't mean he's not getting obliterated. I do it 5 times, you do it 5 times, and 4 other guys also do it = a guy who can't build and quits.
    In the end, a farm is almost always a farm. Once broken open, the flood gates rarely stop, even if the original farmer does back off.
    2 - the game doesn't really make a distinction btwn farming a newb and catting a pro. So you try to chief an enemy hammer while limited to only 5 attack waves and I'm gonna wish you GL and I hope you weren't interested in fakes or anything of that nature.


    Quote Originally Posted by ebol, bags, erazer
    rep, blah blah blah rep
    Yeah, rep hurts the forum newbs and definitely acts as a pre-censorship for a lot of others.
    And that in turn hurts the game as folks don't find any friends on the forum to go back into the game with.

    But there's too much angst over rep to discuss here, and the 2 ideas (make the servers friendlier for newbs and make the forums friendlier for news) are too big to contain in one thread, IMO.

    @FC - I would suggest splitting out the rep part from the server part to make both ideas easier threads to follow.
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    Alright Mok, lets try to keep this thread to Game ideas then. I'll try to find someone with mod powers here to split off the posts about the forums.

    Quote Originally Posted by MokMonster View Post
    Me too.
    I went through the entire ideas section the other day and couldn't find it.
    There was a period where Wren posted like 6 ideas all at w/in a day or 3, and that was (so I thought) one of them.
    I did find a thread of his where he pointed at some of his others, but *this* one wasn't in there, nor were a few others I thought he'd created around the same time. I'll look for that post again later and post it here.
    Do you think the thread could have been deleted? Or is it out there still just hiding extremely well? I'll look again in a bit if you haven't found it yet.

    Quote Originally Posted by tiamat View Post
    1) Make it easier to get decent. This game is frankly hard for a new player, especially one who spawns a month in, so that they're starting way smaller than established players. Anything you can do to help get over the initial "what do I do?" and to hook people up with a team will help.
    a) The manual sucks. Write a more complete one, and link to guides for how to play.
    b) Make it clear to people that the key to success is _teamwork_. Join an alliance, and you both have people helping you get better, and people depending on you, which gives you a reason to come back when something bad happens.
    c) Make it more useful for alliances to recruit a mix of folks. I'm not sure how to do this without causing mega-zerg-alliances that overwhelm a server, but... If an elite alliance takes on a few dozen 3-village-noobs, that doesn't help them very much, but it does cause those few dozen noobs to come back next round.
    By make it easier to get decent, do you mean change the game play, or implementing the ideas in a, b, and c? Or a mixture of both? If you are talking about changing game play to make it easier to get decent, what are some ideas you have to accomplish that?

    I agree that a better manual with links to guides is essential. As well as stressing the importance of teamwork for new players so they make friends, learn, and want to come back. I like your idea of getting alliances to recruit a mix of folks. But also can't think off the top of my head a good way to get that idea rolling, it takes more in-depth thinking for something like that. Although, it does sound like something a mentoring system could encourage. A mentor may be more successful in getting the new player into their alliance, or even into another solid alliance than just that new player by himself.

    Quote Originally Posted by tiamat View Post
    a) The game (at least as of T3.6, I haven't tried 4.0) heavily rewarded hitting people straight out of beginner's protection. Good raiders kept a list of when people within 50 fields of them came out of BP, and had a raid on the way within minutes. That kind of trial by fire isn't a very fun experience for the recipient, and probably causes a lot of the player loss.
    Maybe a solution to this is for each account to have a pre-built cranny that protects a majority of the player's initial resources. The vets would hate it, but it would help new players avoid being farms right out of BP and give them more of a fighting chance to grow.

    What a lot of people might not realize is that the more players that make it through early game and aren't farmed to deletion, the more players there are come mid to end game. Mid to end game is when Travian servers are the most boring because most competition is gone and it's mostly simming until end game with a few random wars between. If more players make it to mid to end game from the beginning then there will be more targets to hit during this quiet time, more chiefing targets at this time, and possibly more players and alliances competing in end game.

    Quote Originally Posted by tiamat View Post
    b) The game doesn't have very good pull-from-behind mechanics. One month in, if I'm larger than you are, I'm probably going to stay that way unless I burn out (and yes, a lot of early heavy raiders do). Larger account == more raiders to send out + more cities building my own resources + more cities producing CP == I'm also growing faster than you, building new cities and new raiders faster. So, barring disaster, I not only stay bigger than you, the gap only gets wider, until at the end it gets trivial for me to cat you into oblivion.
    This is a great point, and something I hadn't considered yet. But ways to help late starters better compete are definite pluses to getting new players to stay and give them a chance to be strong by end game. Many of the people here started on their first server a couple months late, which is something many new players do. Actually, most likely anybody who starts on a server 6 weeks after it starts is a new players.

    Quote Originally Posted by tiamat View Post
    II) Examples of other pull-from-behind mechanics you could implement: a cranny bonus when raided by someone larger. This would encourage large folks to hit medium sized folks, leaving small folks as targets for medium folks, since a large person hitting a small person wouldn't get much. Or the much-hated-by-raiders "limit to how many raids you can have going at once" proposed for T3.something -- again, it means the huge mega-raider starts prioritizing farms, and leaving the smallest ones, which means the one-notch-down raider still has some targets available.
    The cranny bonus when raided by someone larger sounds like an interesting idea. It would offer some protection to new players, smaller players as well as increase the risk and competition due to players attacking others who are closer to their size.

    The Rally Point restrictions weren't bad ideas by TG when it comes to helping new players. Yes, they were extremely annoying for vets. I think instead of removing it totally, TG should have tried to find a way to make it so it didn't restrict vets as much but still helped new players. Maybe that would have been counting only out going attacks and no reinforcements and not restricting the number of attacks by Rally Point level. Maybe when you upgraded the Rally Point to level 1 you could have 20 outgoing attacks and an additional 20 per level until you got to 100. However, 100 outgoing attacks is still a lot.

    Quote Originally Posted by tiamat View Post
    III) Artifacts hurt the game. (again note: I've played T3.x, haven't tried 4.0 yet) Artifacts are a "leaders get further ahead" mechanic -- you have to be a big/strong account to get one, and what does it do? It makes you bigger/stronger. Alliances that aren't big enough to grab them are toast; when my troops are training at double speed and eating half wheat and yours aren't, your days are numbered. So... Something that democratizes artifacts. Make more low-end ones, so they can spread further beyond the big accounts (so, instead of unique/large/small, add a fourth tier "micro". Still count micros against your three-per-account limit; now they're not doing anything useful for the big accounts, who are already getting a decent selection of the existing ones. Make them like half-strength or quarter-strength smalls (so instead of a village 1/2 wheat consumption, it's a village 3/4 or even 7/8 wheat consumption), and make them spawn much further out, so they're easier for alliances doing the boonies thing to grab.
    Artifacts were probably introduced to help spice up mid-game which is usually pretty dull. But I agree they too are helping the stronger players get stronger. I like introducing more small artifacts, but maybe there is another way to spice up mid-game without benefiting those strongest players. Maybe turning artifacts into something that didn't give a bonus to an account, but an alliance needed so many artifacts to build a WW at end-game. Keep it so each player can only have 3 artifacts per account, but an alliance would need a total of 100 artifacts to build the WW to level 100 (1 per level). If a player leaves or gets artifacts stolen come end game then the alliance has to get them back to be able to reach level 100. I guess this would be like extremely small WW plans. But it would require more people participate in end game, take away the extreme bonus the artifacts offer the biggest players in mid-game, and still spice up mid-game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Erazer View Post
    But - Limiting the number of daily raids will solve the problem effectively. That way it matters much less how many duals an account has, and it almost eliminates the problem with 24/7 accounts as one gamer easily can send the limited raids during normal hours.
    I understand where you are coming from from here and it would probably work, but I think that may change Travian a lot. As someone mentioned earlier, once you hit the limit on number of raids/attacks you can do per day then you have nothing else to do but sit there and wait until the next day. Travian is about being a 24/7 game where you can play all day and never run out of things to do or come and go as you wish.

    Maybe you could limit raids per hour and let it reset per hour. Maybe you can only send out 25-50 raids each hour.

    However I think the best ideas to raiding limits would be either something similar to the Rally Point limit that was first on T3.6 or making it so a player can't be attacked more than 10-20 times per day (this includes attacks from all players). At least that sort of protection would be there until they get to a certain size, or reach a milestone like settling a second village.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ms. Evil View Post
    Sorry FC, but when you ask "how do we get this working again" you must first identify what broke.
    Nothing to be sorry about. Conversations like this is why I started this thread. How can anybody improve anything if we don't listen or are not aware to where things can be improved? I always want to be told where I can improve and I'm always open to suggestions on how to do so, especially if what I can do better will make a positive impact or if what I'm doing at the time is making a negative one.

    Ok, I got it split so we can focus on Game discussion here and Forum discussion in the other one. Some posts contained information about both, but in general if it talked about the forum I had it moved to keep things flowing there.
    Last edited by F.C.; 07-14-2011 at 07:56 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Legionnaire67 View Post
    @daily raid restrictions: While I can understand how that would fix the issue, it would add another issue. Why play Travian, with it's simple gameplay and mechanics, when there are more in-depth games which do the whole war thing but with limited raids? I know one of the reasons I play Travian and not some of the others out there is that I can be as active as I like to be, play when I'd like to, and not have to worry about reading "You're out of attacks for today. Please piss off until tomorrow."

    I think that fundamental of a change would be more detrimental than attempting to adjust other facets of the game. Granted, it'd be a much easier fix ... but easier isn't always better.
    It could work to everyone's liking by making a separate raidlimited server and maybe advice beginners to start there. I bet it would become a hugely popular server, as it allows vets to game to the best of their ability within the raidlimit AND have a life beside Travian. I know, I'd play that kind of a server and nothing else. It would be a great alternative for vets who wants to spend less time while still compete.

    The raidlimit could be fashioned in endless manners. It could be progressive and add like 5 raids everyday. Or more. Raids not spent could be transferred to the next day making the game even more balanced, as those who can't game every day gets to raid as many times as those who can. It would make holidays, workplace situations and other stuff less of an issue for many. It would allow for a better travian experience for ppl who has a life.

    Let's try it on a separate server and see how it works. The idea really is sound if I may say so myself, and it wouldn't hurt anyone or the game itself, if we try it out. Chance is it would improve on the game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by F.C. View Post
    Maybe a solution to this is for each account to have a pre-built cranny that protects a majority of the player's initial resources. The vets would hate it, but it would help new players avoid being farms right out of BP and give them more of a fighting chance to grow.
    When I first read this, I thought "why not let the MB have a cranny-like feature embedded in it?" Maybe it would increase with level, or maybe the presence of the building itself would just mean you have 500 completely protected cranny space (without wasting a village build location for a cranny). Then I realized that I usually cat my noob farms that offer any resistance (market, MB, barracks)... and if they still cause problems, then I wheat-lock them. So, while cranny-in-MB would protect from the quick after-BP raids, it wouldn't protect from the big meanies.

    However, if the account itself had a 500-cranny built into it (either as a feature for your spawn, which goes away once you settle a 2nd village... or as a feature for your capital for the whole round), it might be enough to deter most cat-happy vets from constantly knocking down a noob just to get them to delete. And if the noob keeps trying to build back with the 500 resources he keeps protected, his persistence might be enough to get an audience with the vet sooner rather than later.

    Quote Originally Posted by F.C. View Post
    Artifacts were probably introduced to help spice up mid-game which is usually pretty dull. But I agree they too are helping the stronger players get stronger. I like introducing more small artifacts, but maybe there is another way to spice up mid-game without benefiting those strongest players. Maybe turning artifacts into something that didn't give a bonus to an account, but an alliance needed so many artifacts to build a WW at end-game. Keep it so each player can only have 3 artifacts per account, but an alliance would need a total of 100 artifacts to build the WW to level 100 (1 per level). If a player leaves or gets artifacts stolen come end game then the alliance has to get them back to be able to reach level 100. I guess this would be like extremely small WW plans. But it would require more people participate in end game, take away the extreme bonus the artifacts offer the biggest players in mid-game, and still spice up mid-game.
    This could be an interesting new change to the game. It should (in theory) keep more people actively involved from midgame through the end. I'd be willing to give it a try if TG wanted to implement it.

    On a separate note, this proposal was given in response to artifacts being overpowered for the top players (and one option to be adding "micro-arti's"). However, I think T4 has addressed part of that issue. You may not be able to get 50% build time, but most people can now get 15-25% reduction in build time with certain helms in the auctions. And you may not get the 2x speed arti, but you can get boots that speed up your entire army's speed. The auctions do provide some new "micro-arti's".

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    FC, with your permission, I'm going to post some of your original question in our wing's skype chat, and also our forum, and see what comes up and report back here.
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    Quote Originally Posted by dmswartz View Post
    FC, with your permission, I'm going to post some of your original question in our wing's skype chat, and also our forum, and see what comes up and report back here.
    Of course you have my permission, I'd love to hear what everyone has to say. Feel free to link them to the threads too if they want to read/post themselves.
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    This was my Idea Flood, though I never EVER supported a newbie server like this thread is talking about. If you create a soft server, all it does is delay the inevitable harshness of the full game.

    About the game, it needs tremendous overhaul to be appealing again. More ads won't fix the problem, because player retention is low. The reason for this is simple: it has been solved. Endgame is simple, and there is a right way to play to win.

    Solving a game sends fairly tremendous shockwaves throughout the community that plays it. It tends to generate disinterest and contempt from those who understand toward those who don't. All that changes from round to round are teams and drama. Motivation to develop new players shrinks as a round's strategy becomes habitual.

    Repercussions are by no means limited to the callous boredom that can set in, but it is a solid example of how far reaching the effects can be when there's little room for creativity and skill in a game.

    I don't have the solution, but it has to be a game that rewards creativity and player skill much more than the current endgame-centric version does.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wren View Post
    I never EVER supported a newbie server like this thread is talking about. If you create a soft server, all it does is delay the inevitable harshness of the full game.
    And the funny thing is, others WOULD support a newbie server for the exact reason you don't... because it delays the inevitable harshness of the full game. If you can get someone hooked on a slightly softer version, they are probably more likely to stick around and try and "solve" the problem when the harshness hits them.

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    Wren is right, endgame is pretty boring for the most part, wheat-wheat-wheat and defense-defense-defense and by the way don't forget the wheat. I'm waiting to see if they have changed it any in T4. Unless they are exceptional players that is all newbies that actually make it that far will see or know. If the normal harshness isn't enough to make a newbie delete then endgame is a huge let down and they walk away thinking I spent a year for this? It is even worse if their alliance loses.

    Harping on endgame more... You could not pay me enough to hold a WW, sitting one is bad enough, but being an average or smallish player is even worse. Most alliance leaders try to find tasks for average and smallish players to do besides shipping wheat and defense but it isn't always successful.

    But back to player retention... Maybe create some kind of game recognized vassalage feature for mentoring newbies? Reward the Vetran with the most vassels? This type of thing might get the raid happy people to slow down a bit and give newbies a chance. Maybe stick in penalties for attacking your vassal or for the vassal neglecting paying his tribute.
    or
    It's the luck of the draw.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Probability Indigo View Post
    Wren is right, endgame is pretty boring for the most part, wheat-wheat-wheat and defense-defense-defense and by the way don't forget the wheat. I'm waiting to see if they have changed it any in T4.
    They have.
    Now it will be wheat-wheat-wheat-wheat-wheat-wheat b/c the WW no longer has 1/2 wheat consumption.
    What they effectively did is lengthen end-game b/c you'll have less defense packed into the WW, making the EGH stronger.
    Now all those anvils who are maxed out on wheat, the ones who normally breathe a nice sigh of relief when they can finally dump all that D onto a WW, and then start building new troops... well, they can't make additional troops b/c all of their wheat still has to go to support them at the WW.
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    Neither of those solves any problem. The game does not need to be passed on from master to newb, all the answers are posted publicly.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wren View Post
    This was my Idea Flood, though I never EVER supported a newbie server like this thread is talking about.
    Well... that certainly explains why I couldn't find the thread.
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    Endgame is gonna be longer in T4???
    or
    It's the luck of the draw.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Probability Indigo View Post
    Endgame is gonna be longer in T4???
    Haven't been through one yet, but that's the way I understand it, yes.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MokMonster View Post
    Haven't been through one yet, but that's the way I understand it, yes.
    Its hard to say personally I think it will be sorter
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bahara View Post
    Its hard to say personally I think it will be sorter
    I think it'll be unsorted. :P

    But my understanding is that the beta server endgame dragged on for quite a bit.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MokMonster View Post
    I think it'll be unsorted. :P

    But my understanding is that the beta server endgame dragged on for quite a bit.
    Quote Originally Posted by 3NT View Post
    The closed beta started in the end of October (3x speed). Phanttis annouced at march 11th that is was finished = about 20 weeks. I dont know how it was on beta, but at speed servers the plans will spawn at day 90 = 13 weeks. A 6-7 week long EG seems pretty long on a speed server imo, but again this was a beta and it may be different later.

    But as the helmets give larger hammers, and "full crop" in WWs give less defence, WWs should get more damage during a T4-endgame, though its also possible to be done with the infrastructure in a WW earlier than before.

    My understanding was that the closed beta was longer because of the player level. It was an extremely experienced server player base.
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  27. #67
    Philosopher MokMonster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bahara View Post
    My understanding was that the closed beta was longer because of the player level. It was an extremely experienced server player base.
    Perhaps. But 98% of the major players in any WW race are experienced, making your comment match up with mine.
    The guy on his first server is just making some defense and sending wheat during EG. It is the guys who've played a few rounds who will have the 100K+ EG hammer, enormous anvil, or the capability to take and hold a WW.

    So my guess is still that EG on T4 will be extended due to hammers being more destructive to a WW (due to the full wheat defense being smaller).
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  28. #68

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    I'd like to know who let the nub "colledge" grad design the map overview. There has been clearly no thought about gameplay when doing this.

    Whats the point of a flexible/enlarged capable map, when manuvering around it is like trying to waiting for a pron picture to slowly scroll down with a 56k modem...

  29. #69

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    Quote Originally Posted by Baghernia View Post
    I'd like to know who let the nub "colledge" grad design the map overview. There has been clearly no thought about gameplay when doing this.

    Whats the point of a flexible/enlarged capable map, when manuvering around it is like trying to waiting for a pron picture to slowly scroll down with a 56k modem...
    Which server is like that? S7 is usually about as fast as you could expect considering how that info has to be fetched from the server which is running more game worlds simultaneously then the numbers you can count on your fingers and toes. Usually no more the 1-2 secs for me. Why they can't afford a few extra servers I don't know.
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  30. #70

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    There should be beginner servers.

    What I mean by this is they will be short 1 or 2 month servers where you can't buy gold or anything and it is just to get the hang of the game. It will play out like a normal game... Everything would cost very cheap and there wouldn't be many monsters in the WW and stuff.

    This way new players could have fun while they understand the game before getting stuck in a game with people who have played since day 1 of travian buying lots of gold.

    If you want more player to join you are going to have to use some of the money you guys have. Make lots of ads and put them on other popular game websites.. I.E Runescape and forums of runescape.

    Maybe for some money put ads on the top of the travian beginner servers.

  31. #71

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    Quote Originally Posted by ShadowRose View Post
    Which server is like that? S7 is usually about as fast as you could expect considering how that info has to be fetched from the server which is running more game worlds simultaneously then the numbers you can count on your fingers and toes. Usually no more the 1-2 secs for me. Why they can't afford a few extra servers I don't know.
    1-2 secs seems to be the minimal, which in itself is excessive compared to t3x

    But the real stinger is the not so rare lag of 5-10secs.

    Havign said that are you looking at the expanded map overview?

  32. #72

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    Quote Originally Posted by Baghernia View Post
    1-2 secs seems to be the minimal, which in itself is excessive compared to t3x

    But the real stinger is the not so rare lag of 5-10secs.

    Havign said that are you looking at the expanded map overview?
    Yeah. I was doing a lot of full screen and 50% zoom, on a 1920 x 1080 resolution 27' monitor for awhile. It made it easy to chart a bunch of natar farms. I moved around with relative ease. That was a month ago, internal conflict led me to go pretty much inactive. I still sell crap on auction to try and get some of the gold I bought back but I don't have access to the full screen map anymore. Plus is gone. Small map works less then one sec right now on s7 no matter how fast I move it.
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  33. #73

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    I have the same monitor, I'm not even using full screen just half, its that laggy.

    Even back when it was "good" the intermittant dealy was still damn annoying.

    Also I've always stuck to the so called "low resolution" map since moving around was never consistent enough to feel comfortable with where I was on the map


    Wow just realised the links, is limited to 9 showing, with a "next page" arrow" to see the next 9. Who's brilliant idea was this.

    Wonderful isn't it that so many of these small changes weren't part of the T4 page informing of proposed changes.
    Last edited by Baghernia; 07-17-2011 at 06:04 AM.

  34. #74

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    I skipped most of the posts before this, read maybe the first 3 or 4 pages. Found out I agree with a whole lot of what Baghernia said so I'll try hard not to repeat.
    When I first started playing Travian, I didn't come to the forums for months. Was my old buddy Lazarus who poked my interest, so you've him to blame.
    I started playing Travian at work 3 years ago? 4? Can't remember now, but a co-worker introduced it to me and invited me to his server. I joined the wrong server that was mid-way through its lifespan and still ended up having a hell of a good time (catted often, too).
    One thing that I and my friend Tom, who I convinced to join me, loved about travian back then was if you wanted to send multiple waves in the same second, you just had to set up your first with troop numbers divided and rapidly hit Send over and over. Laugh, but we were getting out 7 or 8 waves in a second that way. When Travian fixed that, Tom quit. He had absolutely no desire to sit there and set up multiple tabs while working offline and then hit 'Send' over and over. Far too much work involved and I agree. Its rare that I will take the time to do that. Its one of the stupidest things about this game - you need to hack your browser, strip it down, to send fast multiple attacks? Bizarre.
    I stayed on with Travian because of the people I found here that I came to like and respect dearly and I kept coming back even when RL was being at its worse. The game is fun at times but mostly like a job you don't get paid for. The people, however, rock.

    Want to get people to play more? Stop making everything like pulling teeth. T4 has a lot going for it in the right direction but there is still so much more to do to stop your number of players from bleeding away. Make Travian less like a job and more like the fun game it can so easily be.

    Also, about the forums? Mods need to be be less participatory and more "seen but not heard." Exceptions being such as this wonderful thread FC started. We have mods flaming in threads, for Gump's sake. You wanna be a player who stretches/tests limits, don't be a Mod. I've seen it in multiple servers' Embassies and it simply does nothing to sustain life for Travian.
    Quote Originally Posted by gebne View Post
    St. Chak, glorious atelier, faithful servant and bearer of thong,
    the stain of the troll has caused you to be forgotten by many,
    but the true forum invokes you universally as the patron of things despised of;
    pray for me, that finally I may receive the alterations and the couture of thongs in all my fripperies, ornamentations, and trimmings,
    particularly those of purple hue, and that I may read Chak with the thong throughout Eternity.

  35. #75

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Chak View Post
    I skipped most of the posts before this, read maybe the first 3 or 4 pages. Found out I agree with a whole lot of what Baghernia said so I'll try hard not to repeat.
    When I first started playing Travian, I didn't come to the forums for months. Was my old buddy Lazarus who poked my interest, so you've him to blame.
    I started playing Travian at work 3 years ago? 4? Can't remember now, but a co-worker introduced it to me and invited me to his server. I joined the wrong server that was mid-way through its lifespan and still ended up having a hell of a good time (catted often, too).
    One thing that I and my friend Tom, who I convinced to join me, loved about travian back then was if you wanted to send multiple waves in the same second, you just had to set up your first with troop numbers divided and rapidly hit Send over and over. Laugh, but we were getting out 7 or 8 waves in a second that way. When Travian fixed that, Tom quit. He had absolutely no desire to sit there and set up multiple tabs while working offline and then hit 'Send' over and over. Far too much work involved and I agree. Its rare that I will take the time to do that. Its one of the stupidest things about this game - you need to hack your browser, strip it down, to send fast multiple attacks? Bizarre.
    I stayed on with Travian because of the people I found here that I came to like and respect dearly and I kept coming back even when RL was being at its worse. The game is fun at times but mostly like a job you don't get paid for. The people, however, rock.

    Want to get people to play more? Stop making everything like pulling teeth. T4 has a lot going for it in the right direction but there is still so much more to do to stop your number of players from bleeding away. Make Travian less like a job and more like the fun game it can so easily be.

    Also, about the forums? Mods need to be be less participatory and more "seen but not heard." Exceptions being such as this wonderful thread FC started. We have mods flaming in threads, for Gump's sake. You wanna be a player who stretches/tests limits, don't be a Mod. I've seen it in multiple servers' Embassies and it simply does nothing to sustain life for Travian.
    No matter what you do you can only get 4 per second on t4
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  36. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Chak View Post
    ...back then was if you wanted to send multiple waves in the same second, you just had to set up your first with troop numbers divided and rapidly hit Send over and over.
    Great for fakes, bad for trying to hit specific things.
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  37. #77

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    Quote Originally Posted by MokMonster View Post
    Great for fakes, bad for trying to hit specific things.
    No, actually great for hitting specific things if you break it down.
    For example, take a Roman player with 10,000 Imps, 5,000 EC, 1,000 Legos, 1,000, Rams and 1,000 cats.
    You would set it up as 10,000 Imps, 5,000 EC, 100 Legos, 1,000 rams and 100 cats. When you hit the button over and over, only the first wave would have the Imps, EC and Rams. The following waves would have only 100 legos and 100 cats in each one because you had sent out all your Imps, EC and Rams in your first wave!
    The funny thing is I didn't know the secret of stripping down your mac or the auto-refresh thingee that needs to be adjusted. We would have been KILLER n00bs if we had known that.
    We weren't called Window Lickers United for nothing, sir.
    Quote Originally Posted by gebne View Post
    St. Chak, glorious atelier, faithful servant and bearer of thong,
    the stain of the troll has caused you to be forgotten by many,
    but the true forum invokes you universally as the patron of things despised of;
    pray for me, that finally I may receive the alterations and the couture of thongs in all my fripperies, ornamentations, and trimmings,
    particularly those of purple hue, and that I may read Chak with the thong throughout Eternity.

  38. #78

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Chak View Post
    No, actually great for hitting specific things if you break it down.
    For example, take a Roman player with 10,000 Imps, 5,000 EC, 1,000 Legos, 1,000, Rams and 1,000 cats.
    You would set it up as 10,000 Imps, 5,000 EC, 100 Legos, 1,000 rams and 100 cats. When you hit the button over and over, only the first wave would have the Imps, EC and Rams. The following waves would have only 100 legos and 100 cats in each one because you had sent out all your Imps, EC and Rams in your first wave!
    The funny thing is I didn't know the secret of stripping down your mac or the auto-refresh thingee that needs to be adjusted. We would have been KILLER n00bs if we had known that.
    We weren't called Window Lickers United for nothing, sir.
    the second wave woud have 100 legos the rest would just have cata unless I am missing something.
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  39. #79

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bahara View Post
    the second wave woud have 100 legos the rest would just have cata unless I am missing something.
    Every wave you got off after that would each have 100 legos and 100 cats. Thing is, so would your first wave but that isn't necessarily a bad thing.
    It worked for us. You'd just cancel any that didn't fall in the one or two seconds you were aiming for (I got 17 off with a second between them once). You also had to double check to make sure that your first wave actually went first and didn't somehow end up second. That happened more than once.
    Quote Originally Posted by gebne View Post
    St. Chak, glorious atelier, faithful servant and bearer of thong,
    the stain of the troll has caused you to be forgotten by many,
    but the true forum invokes you universally as the patron of things despised of;
    pray for me, that finally I may receive the alterations and the couture of thongs in all my fripperies, ornamentations, and trimmings,
    particularly those of purple hue, and that I may read Chak with the thong throughout Eternity.

  40. #80

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Chak View Post
    The funny thing is I didn't know the secret of stripping down your mac or the auto-refresh thingee that needs to be adjusted. We would have been KILLER n00bs if we had known that.
    We weren't called Window Lickers United for nothing, sir.
    Most "top" accounts on every server I've seen, still don't know how to/can be bother to.

    I'd say only a handful of accounts on each server consistently send 7-8 in 1 second. Now and then that can multiply if you have a good alliance that helps each other and have people who listen.

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