View Poll Results: Would you let your son wear a dress?

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  • Sure, why not?

    20 46.51%
  • Ok, but just to a certain age...

    1 2.33%
  • Yes, but only in private.

    6 13.95%
  • Yes, but only for special occasions where it can be excused.

    0 0%
  • Maybe just once.

    4 9.30%
  • Hell no.

    12 27.91%
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Thread: Would you let your son wear a dress?

  1. #1

    Default Would you let your son wear a dress?

    Just wondering...my feminist friend and I were discussing child rearing and he's big on equal treatment if he has a daughter, letting her be whatever she wants to be and deviate from gender norms. But when I asked about boys...it's a different story. Personally, if my future son wants to wear a dress, I'd say go for it.

    Why stick to rigid gender expectations? I'll warn him about the crap to expect but if he thinks he can handle it, I won't stop him.
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  2. #2

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    Damn, that's a bit of a tough question. I would be quite worried about the, as you put it, "crap to expect"; that could potentially be pretty traumatic. I guess that I would let them, so long as they were fully aware of just how awfully some people might treat them...

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    I voted the second option since it was the closest to "Sure, but only after a certain age." Though I don't see why this hypothetical son would strongly desire to wear them.
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  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cora View Post
    Just wondering...my feminist friend and I were discussing child rearing and he's big on equal treatment if he has a daughter, letting her be whatever she wants to be and deviate from gender norms. But when I asked about boys...it's a different story. Personally, if my future son wants to wear a dress, I'd say go for it.

    Why stick to rigid gender expectations? I'll warn him about the crap to expect but if he thinks he can handle it, I won't stop him.
    Hell no. If I catch my son wearing a dress, I'm calling the police and telling them that Cora has kidnapped him.. I've seen what you do.
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    Idiot.

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    I swear to God you are the most frustrating and irritating person I've encountered in over 3 years of posting here. Do I sound like the kind of person that would struggle to understand something, do I come across to you as being below averagely dim ?

    I'd even believe you are being obtuse on purpose.

  5. #5
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    It strikes me as being more traumatic to the child not to let them wear the skirt, but I'd certainly prefer to keep it private until he was old enough to understand why people are treating him badly. That said, no stopping him.

    This though is a little strange to me:
    http://www.parentcentral.ca/parent/b...-gender-secret

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    Quote Originally Posted by Creep-er View Post
    I voted the second option since it was the closest to "Sure, but only after a certain age." Though I don't see why this hypothetical son would strongly desire to wear them.
    The breeze? How long they make his legs look? He just likes the look of them?

  7. #7

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    I think as a parent you should protect your child first and foremost. You have to understand and respect the fact a child does not have a fully developed brain. This is not a slight at children's intelligence, there are just reasons why minors are treated to different standards and rules than adults.

    You can warn a child not to touch something hot but eventually they need to get burned, or see what happens when you get burned, to actually understand why we don't touch hot things. A simple burn is easy to deal with, serious burns can stay with you for a long time.

    You protect your child by teaching them how to avoid getting hurt and most importantly give them the tools to deal with getting hurt... simply warning a child of the dangers of getting hurt offers very little protection in itself.

    So hell no, I would not allow my son to wear female cloths in public, just to make the child happy. My kids would be free to do as they wish once they are adults and are prepared for the outside world. Unconditional love and proper parenting are not mutually exclusive, kids need their parents to be their parents. You are only a child once, you have your whole adult life to be friends with your parents.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cora View Post
    rigid gender
    that's what she said
    Last edited by Erbal; 05-31-2011 at 01:32 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Belladonna View Post
    The breeze?
    Oh my goodness. He'd better not go commando then.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Creep-er View Post
    Though I don't see why this hypothetical son would strongly desire to wear them.
    I like my miniskirt thanks. Goes so well with my knee socks.


  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    I like my miniskirt thanks. Goes so well with my knee socks.
    That's no miniskirt, that's a short dress, it's past the knees almost down to the ankles.

    ^ This is a miniskirt. ^
    Does anyone really want their boy going to school wearing one of these because he thinks it's a good idea?


    ^ How about wearing one of these around town? ^
    Get real.
    Last edited by Erbal; 05-31-2011 at 01:40 AM.
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  11. #11

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    I have an aunt who totally encourages her son to wear dresses and such. She's so annoying. I'm all for letting kids make choices and stuff, but you just tell your son. He dresses are for girls, and this is for boys. Most kids will be fine with that explanation and not want to wear the dress..

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    Quote Originally Posted by Erbal View Post
    I think as a parent you should protect your child first and foremost. You have to understand and respect the fact a child does not have a fully developed brain. This is not a slight at children's intelligence, there are just reasons why minors are treated to different standards and rules than adults.

    You can warn a child not to touch something hot but eventually they need to get burned, or see what happens when you get burned, to actually understand why we don't touch hot things. A simple burn is easy to deal with, serious burns can stay with you for a long time.

    You protect your child by teaching them how to avoid getting hurt and most importantly give them the tools to deal with getting hurt... simply warning a child of the dangers of getting hurt offers very little protection in itself.

    So hell no, I would not allow my son to wear female cloths in public, just to make the child happy. My kids would be free to do as they wish once they are adults and are prepared for the outside world. Unconditional love and proper parenting are not mutually exclusive, kids need their parents to be their parents. You are only a child once, you have your whole adult life to be friends with your parents.
    Wow, I actually agree with Erbal. Completely.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old MacDonald View Post
    Wow, I actually agree with Erbal. Completely.
    You really wouldn't allow your child to express their sexuality before they were 18? Or actually worse, make them think that how they feel is somehow wrong?

    I don't disagree with some parts of his statement, but the adult part rankles.

    I firmly believe that children should not be taught that being different is wrong. Which is what it comes down to. It is what they will understand.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    You really wouldn't allow your child to express their sexuality before they were 18? Or actually worse, make them think that how they feel is somehow wrong?
    You act as if wearing a dress in public is the only way for a male to express their sexuality.

    I don't disagree with some parts of his statement, but the adult part rankles.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    I firmly believe that children should not be taught that being different is wrong. Which is what it comes down to. It is what they will understand.
    Being different is fine, but I'm not going to let my kid, potentially at a young age and likely undeveloped, as Erbal stated, subject himself to the kind of bullying that will undoubtedly come from cross-dressing. I'm willing to bet that I've seen the effects of bullying more closely than you have, and I'm not about to let my child bring that upon himself. When he grows up and figures out who he really is, I'll accept him and love him no matter what.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Creep-er View Post
    I voted the second option since it was the closest to "Sure, but only after a certain age." Though I don't see why this hypothetical son would strongly desire to wear them.
    The thing is that some kids just don't feel right in their skin and feel they should have been born the other gender. This is true of both boys and girls.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    It strikes me as being more traumatic to the child not to let them wear the skirt, but I'd certainly prefer to keep it private until he was old enough to understand why people are treating him badly. That said, no stopping him.
    This! Like I said, for some boys NOT wearing a dress feels wrong. I know a 5 year old kid who has been saying since he was 3 that he thinks he should be a girl. I know another grown man who says that when he was a kid he would wear his mothers clothes. This man now has some... er... let's say "issues" today because his family didn't allow him to be himself as a kid.

    Lastly, to all those people saying you wouldn't let the boy wear a dress so that it would "protect him" from getting hurt. I'm not sure I agree with that. If the boy wants to wear a dress, the odds are he is probably going to have some other feminine qualities. Or if you force him to repress that part of himself he's going to grow up to be shy and not very outgoing, which in itself is reason enough for kids to mock him at school.

    Don't underestimate how cruel kids can be. But also remember how kids are easily influenced. If little John wants to wear a dress at the age of 4, and all his friends get to know him as "the boy who wears a dress" I believe there is a good chance they will grow up to accept him as he is. On the flip side, if you force him to wear "normal clothes" say until he's 18 when, all of a sudden, he starts wearing a dress, high heels and hair extensions; think of how devastating it will be for him when all his "friends" turn away from him feeling betrayed that he was never truthful about who he really was with them.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old MacDonald View Post
    You act as if wearing a dress in public is the only way for a male to express their sexuality.
    Being a transvestite is your sexuality. Well not yours personally, but you see what I mean. It is definitely a sexuality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Old MacDonald View Post
    Being different is fine, but I'm not going to let my kid, potentially at a young age and likely undeveloped, as Erbal stated, subject himself to the kind of bullying that will undoubtedly come from cross-dressing. I'm willing to bet that I've seen the effects of bullying more closely than you have, and I'm not about to let my child bring that upon himself. When he grows up and figures out who he really is, I'll accept him and love him no matter what.
    So you basically say yes, but from a certain age. What age would you put that at?

    Because when I see 8 year olds wearing hooker boots, I certainly know when we are starting teaching that hetrosexuality is something to be flaunted from.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    Being a transvestite is your sexuality. Well not yours personally, but you see what I mean. It is definitely a sexuality.
    I won't argue with that, but do really think a boy, let's say 12 years of age, would really, truly, without any doubts, know that they're not "normal"?



    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    So you basically say yes, but from a certain age. What age would you put that at?.
    Just like the proper age to start having sex, there's no absolute here. It's dependent on the situation.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    It strikes me as being more traumatic to the child not to let them wear the skirt,
    Okay, seriously, that's just a downright stupid thing to say.

    You are saying that it would be more traumatic to be told "no" on clothing than it would be to suffer through taunting, bullying, and other types of harassment that crossdressers have to suffer through? Really? What's next, saying that it's more traumatic to make a child stop bottle-feeding than it is for them to deal with the social stigma of being a "big baby"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    This though is a little strange to me:
    http://www.parentcentral.ca/parent/b...-gender-secret
    More than anything else, it makes me think of the Diskworld dwarves.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old MacDonald View Post
    I won't argue with that, but do really think a boy, let's say 12 years of age, would really, truly, without any doubts, know that they're not "normal"?
    Probably yes. I was certainly getting the first stirrings in my trousers when looking at girls before then.

    What I disagree most with is the "without any doubts" part. Does it really matter? Should kids not be allowed to experiment a little? I bloody well did. Whether my parents liked it or not really.

    And parents knowing is a wonderful thing. Then they can explain why he is getting bullied. Due to small mindedness basically. Not because what he is doing is something wrong. It isn't. We're all different.

    Forcing hetrosexuality on someone is not right. It just isn't. And that is what you are basically advocating.

    Quote Originally Posted by Old MacDonald View Post
    Just like the proper age to start having sex, there's no absolute here. It's dependent on the situation.
    Of course.

    EDIT to include:

    Quote Originally Posted by Woden View Post
    You are saying that it would be more traumatic to be told "no" on clothing than it would be to suffer through taunting, bullying, and other types of harassment that crossdressers have to suffer through? Really? What's next, saying that it's more traumatic to make a child stop bottle-feeding than it is for them to deal with the social stigma of being a "big baby"?
    If you are repressing their sexuality and making them believe that it is somehow wrong, yes. See Mita's post for why.


    Quote Originally Posted by Woden View Post
    More than anything else, it makes me think of the Diskworld dwarves.
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    Last edited by Kurtz; 05-31-2011 at 02:48 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    Forcing hetrosexuality on someone is not right. It just isn't. And that is what you are basically advocating.
    False. If my son ends up being homosexual, that's fine, I've got no issues with that, but I'm not going to let my son put himself through hell for something he isn't sure about. If I had decided that I wanted to wear dresses throughout high school/middle school, and my parents let me, only for me to realize that it's not who I am, and still have that lasting stigma of "that *** who wears dresses", I'd not only be mad at myself, but I'd resent them. Perhaps my son would resent me if I didn't let him wear dresses until he was older, but as I see it, it's my job to make sure he's safe, both physically and mentally.

    I don't know how things are in Norway, but in America, people have been picked on, beaten up, and even killed for MUCH less (See:The Laramie Project). If my kid ends up hating me for "suppressing his sexuality", so be it, because I'll be protecting him from the inevitable social shunning and possible physical danger.
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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old MacDonald View Post
    I don't know how things are in Norway, but in America, people have been picked on, beaten up, and even killed for MUCH less (See:The Laramie Project). If my kid ends up hating me for "suppressing his sexuality", so be it, because I'll be protecting him from the inevitable social shunning and possible physical danger.
    I believe most European countries now have some form of same sex marriage thing, but yes it does still cause some bullying. It is not completely tolerated everywhere yet. Not heard of anyone getting killed for it though. Not in the last decade or 3 anyway.

    I listened to a program on the radio around 3 years ago about how bad it is to be homosexual in Norway. They might get called **** (well the Norwegian slur anyway) and get their hair pulled (I have no idea why this is something that happens), but otherwise they are safe enough.

    Most other Europeans countries are about the same as that. At least in the west. Well, except the UK. But then, the British are always a bit weird as compared with the rest of Europe.

  22. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    I listened to a program on the radio around 3 years ago about how bad it is to be homosexual in Norway. They might get called **** (well the Norwegian slur anyway) and get their hair pulled (I have no idea why this is something that happens), but otherwise they are safe enough.
    Yeah... that's downright tame compared to some of the stuff that happens in the U.S.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Woden View Post
    Yeah... that's downright tame compared to some of the stuff that happens in the U.S.
    ^This. Here, that stuff happens to you even if you're completely heterosexual. Like I said, if you can, watch The Laramie Project. It's powerful, and tells about the story of a homosexual student who was beaten and killed simply because of his sexual orientation.
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    It seems to me everyone is so caught up on "what would others think". Who the hell cares? I won't deny that young kids won't have a fully developed brain and blah blah blah. BUT, you need to realize that things like sexuality are hardwired into you at a very young age. I've mentioned two examples in my previous post, and I could easily bring up more, but they wouldn't really relate to the cross-dressing theme of this thread.

    The fact is that forcing your child to suppress a part of himself out of the fear of what others MIGHT say will probably have much more lasting effects than him getting bullied. I was bullied as a kid, not for cross dressing but because I'm a dancer. Yes it was hard when I was a kid and my "friends" laughed at me and called me names. That being said, today most of them are jealous of my talent. I'm not saying that people would eventually become jealous of the cross-dresser... but what I'm saying is that bullying is a phase that kids will grow out of. It's not a reason to deny your child who he is.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mitachuk View Post
    It seems to me everyone is so caught up on "what would others think". Who the hell cares? I won't deny that young kids won't have a fully developed brain and blah blah blah. BUT, you need to realize that things like sexuality are hardwired into you at a very young age. I've mentioned two examples in my previous post, and I could easily bring up more, but they wouldn't really relate to the cross-dressing theme of this thread.
    Let's not start this debate, or we'll have a repeat of the Osama thread.
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  26. #26

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    Prob age/understanding based.

    Kids don't understand what they're doing, the implication, how you explain it to them so they can decide themselves is difficult.

    Its not big leap to believe this is happening more and more as the stereotypes of what is a man and a woman are broken down.


    I read an article about a kid 12-13? Part of the student council, who wore a dress to school, as a form of protest about not being able to wear shorts due to the heat, but a loophole meant he could wear a skirt.

    I can't imagine that happening 20-40 years ago...

  27. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    Being a transvestite is your sexuality. Well not yours personally, but you see what I mean. It is definitely a sexuality.
    Since when is being a transvestite a sexuality?

    Sexuality = A person's sexual orientation
    Sexual Orientation = A person's sexual identity in relation to the gender to which they are attracted; the fact of being heterosexual, homosexual, or bisexual.

    Transvestite = A person, typically a man, who derives pleasure from dressing in clothes appropriate to the opposite sex.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    I like my miniskirt thanks. Goes so well with my knee socks.

    Like there is any further argument needed? A man in a kilt is just awesome!

    Besides, the more you tell a kid NO, the more it will push him to do it. Reverse psychology ftw!
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    This is all dependent on age. The same I wouldn't let my son wear a shirt with swear words on it when he was in elementary school, I wouldn't let him wear a dress. Once he understands the implications of it all, then more power to him to wear dresses.
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    Some of you guys misinterpreted my post.
    It's not about depriving your child of being who they really are, it's about first teaching your child what to expect and how to deal with what they will face in the real world before you give them a free pass to do whatever they want, to essentially permit your child to be innocently vulnerable to negative experiences that could potentially impact their lives.

    For example, if your child feels they are destined to be a great musician, it's who they are and you all know it. Are you going to let them drop out of middle school to practice music all day because your kid thinks school is stopping him from being the person he really is? Hell no, keep them in school, you keep preparing them for life, and you also support their music ambitions, just within the confines of proper parenting.

    Being a good parent means sometimes your kid will hate you because you made the right choice. F-ing up your kids mind because you don't give them unconditional love and treat them like crap because you can't handle your kid being different is the direct opposite of being a good parent.
    Excuse me for disagreeing that your degeneracy is sacred.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Erbal View Post
    Some of you guys misinterpreted my post.
    It's not about depriving your child of being who they really are, it's about first teaching your child what to expect and how to deal with what they will face in the real world before you give them a free pass to do whatever they want, to essentially permit your child to be innocently vulnerable to negative experiences that could potentially impact their lives.

    For example, if your child feels they are destined to be a great musician, it's who they are and you all know it. Are you going to let them drop out of middle school to practice music all day because your kid thinks school is stopping him from being the person he really is? Hell no, keep them in school, you keep preparing them for life, and you also support their music ambitions, just within the confines of proper parenting.

    Being a good parent means sometimes your kid will hate you because you made the right choice. F-ing up your kids mind because you don't give them unconditional love and treat them like crap because you can't handle your kid being different is the direct opposite of being a good parent.
    I understand what you are saying. But I still don't agree. Think about it this way.

    Your son is 4 years old and wants to wear a dress. He doesn't see anything wrong with that. You and I both know this isn't "normal" behaviour; however at 4 years old his mind has not been clouded with society's many prejudices. What are the odds that the other 4 year old who play with your son will know any better.

    People need to stop looking at the world through their grown up eyes and realize that if we want to make this world a better place where homosexuals, transgendered people... you name it, can be themselves and not worry about bullying, abuse, etc... it will need to start with the children.
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  32. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by mitachuk View Post
    I understand what you are saying. But I still don't agree. Think about it this way.

    Your son is 4 years old and wants to wear a dress. He doesn't see anything wrong with that. You and I both know this isn't "normal" behaviour; however at 4 years old his mind has not been clouded with society's many prejudices. What are the odds that the other 4 year old who play with your son will know any better.

    People need to stop looking at the world through their grown up eyes and realize that if we want to make this world a better place where homosexuals, transgendered people... you name it, can be themselves and not worry about bullying, abuse, etc... it will need to start with the children.
    4 year old's look ambiguous, they all sound and look the same, their cloths and haircuts are what make them look different to us but a 4 year old doesn't understand what different is. I assumed we were talking about children who actually have memories and are in school.

    Bullies are allowed to exist usually because their parents are not wise to put an end to that behavior. You can't parent every child, only your own. If every parent was perfect there wouldn't be bullies and your kids wouldn't be bothered with BS drama because unbiased kids treat each other amazingly well. This is not reality all the time, your kid only has one childhood, and as your child's parent it is your responsibility to give unconditional love while protecting your child and preparing them for the world.

    Kids need parenting and guidelines, you can't let children call every shot. Most people shouldn't even have kids, if people were required to have a baby making license based on a reasonable ability to make quality parenting decisions there would never be risk of overpopulation.

    I guess we agree to disagree.
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  33. #33

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    I voted "sure, why not?"

    That said, I don't remember deciding my clothes until about age ~7 maybe? My parents weren't so big on gender roles, being the younger or my sister and I, most of my toys and clothes were hand-me-downs from my older sister. Perhaps the most effeminent thing I had growing up were the wearing of abarcas shoes, it wasn't until last year that I heard the comparison of them to ballerina shoes. Though, I see the resemblance now that I've never noticed growing up.


    Sometimes I feel a bit naive to gender roles, kind of like choosing the name "Summer", it didn't occur to me at the time that the name is "more feminine". I hug and kiss a lot, some guy friends and family I kiss on the cheek or forehead on upon greeting or while joking around. Actually, remembering back to elementary school the first time I've ever heard the word "gay" was in reference to me when I kissed a boy on the cheek on the playground (I was kissing girls on the cheek as well), I don't know why I did it. But another boy started calling me gay, I didn't even know what the word meant. We went back to the class and the boy kept calling me gay, I was still oblivious to the word. Then our teacher (from France) overheard the taunting and asked what was going on, then the boy said about me "he kisses boys", our teacher responded "so? I kiss my friends who are boys." I remember about a few days later I was taken to a counselor's office, a women, and it went something like "don't kiss on the playground." I think the parents of my classmates got kinda tea'd. My childhood was kinda like that.

    So hypothetically, if I had a son.... There would be many interests and identities that he would likely enjoy and pursue, I would let him explore and encourage whatever hobby or interest. Wearing a dress, I really don't know much about dresses, if it became his hobby, then go for it.

    That said, I wouldn't likely dress him up in a dress for the sake of doing it. But, would support his interests, ignoring gender roles.
    Last edited by Summer; 05-31-2011 at 04:40 AM.

  34. #34
    Merchant mitachuk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erbal View Post
    Kids need parenting and guidelines, you can't let children call every shot. Most people shouldn't even have kids, if people were required to have a baby making license based on a reasonable ability to make quality parenting decisions there would never be risk of overpopulation.

    I guess we agree to disagree.
    I am in no way saying that a child should be allowed to run wild and run the household. That's just poor parenting and leads to horrible children and nightmares in classrooms. What I am saying is that in telling a child "no you can't wear a dress because it's wrong" you are conditioning him to grow up and resent who he is.

    It *could* just be a phase through which he is passing... if so... then what's the problem. If not, at least he's going to grow up not resenting himself.

    Quote Originally Posted by Summer View Post
    Perhaps the most effeminent thing I had growing up were the wearing of abarcas shoes, it wasn't until last year that I heard the comparison of them to ballerina shoes. Though, I see the resemblance now that I've never noticed growing up.
    hehe... one of the main reasons for which I was bullied in school is that I was a male ballerina. The only reason I am no longer a ballerina is that when I got to grade 12 I didn't have time to keep up with practice and all that. I'm not gay, not effeminate in any way, but I did enjoy ballet; although I did enjoy my tap and jazz lessons a lot more.

    But mostly what I wanted to say is that your childhood is exactly what I was trying to explain... that if kids bully those who are different it's only because they are taught that it's "wrong" to be different. If we could all be a little more open minded there would be a lot less problems in our world.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mitachuk View Post
    I am in no way saying that a child should be allowed to run wild and run the household. That's just poor parenting and leads to horrible children and nightmares in classrooms. What I am saying is that in telling a child "no you can't wear a dress because it's wrong" you are conditioning him to grow up and resent who he is.

    It *could* just be a phase through which he is passing... if so... then what's the problem. If not, at least he's going to grow up not resenting himself.
    Option #3: No, you can't wear a dress to school because I don't feel you are ready to handle the consequences of those actions. (explain the consequences) I love and support you no matter what, we can try to find a compromise, but I'm not allowing you to jump straight into wearing a dress to school because there are more effective ways to express yourself than dressing inappropriately.

    A phase dies off a lot faster than things like yearbook photos of a male wearing dresses to school.
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  36. #36
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    Thanks to advances in medicine, you can pick your gender when you are old enough.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Erbal View Post
    [...]and as your child's parent it is your responsibility to give unconditional love while protecting your child and preparing them for the world.

    Kids need parenting and guidelines,
    These, with emphasis on the "preparing them for the world" and the last sentence fragment I quoted.

    Regardless of what you believe about "letting the kids be themselves," there are guidelines that they will be expected to follow when they grow up. While they may be able to get by with crossdressing (so long as they aren't in a highly conservative area), the general idea of "just let kids do what they want" is bad, in my experience, because it doesn't teach kids how to deal with real-life issues like authority--say, for example, a strict boss. Kids need to learn that, sometimes, they do have to do things that they don't like; that's an important job skill, and a fact of life as well.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erbal View Post
    Option #3: No, you can't wear a dress to school because I don't feel you are ready to handle the consequences of those actions. (explain the consequences) I love and support you no matter what, we can try to find a compromise, but I'm not allowing you to jump straight into wearing a dress to school because there are more effective ways to express yourself than dressing inappropriately.

    A phase dies off a lot faster than things like yearbook photos of a male wearing dresses to school.
    Rocket science made simple.
    So... it's ok for him to wear a dress when playing with his friends at home?.. But not at school?

    Or are you still saying that he should be ashamed of who he is and not let it show to anyone but family.. or is family still too much? Maybe he could wear a dress in his room by himself.

    Quote Originally Posted by Woden View Post
    These, with emphasis on the "preparing them for the world" and the last sentence fragment I quoted.

    Regardless of what you believe about "letting the kids be themselves," there are guidelines that they will be expected to follow when they grow up. While they may be able to get by with crossdressing (so long as they aren't in a highly conservative area), the general idea of "just let kids do what they want" is bad, in my experience, because it doesn't teach kids how to deal with real-life issues like authority--say, for example, a strict boss. Kids need to learn that, sometimes, they do have to do things that they don't like; that's an important job skill, and a fact of life as well.
    Why are people equating "allow a boy to wear a dress" with "let the kids run wild and rule the house".
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  39. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by mitachuk View Post
    So... it's ok for him to wear a dress when playing with his friends at home?.. But not at school?

    Or are you still saying that he should be ashamed of who he is and not let it show to anyone but family.. or is family still too much? Maybe he could wear a dress in his room by himself.
    It's ok for you to smoke a pound of crack cocaine with your friends in private, it's not ok for you to do this at work or school.
    It's ok for you to be a nudist in private, it's not ok for you to show up at work or school fully nude.
    It's ok for you to literally allow people **** and piss all over you, it's just not ok to do this at work or school.
    It's ok for you to do millions of things in private, it's not always appropriate to do these things in all public places, there is nothing to be ashamed of for understanding what is wrong and what is appropriate.

    Is the pattern clear yet? You can't give a child free reign to decide what is or is not appropriate. You give them guidelines and allow them to make choices inside those guidelines. And you don't crack at the first sad face or the first time they tell you they hate you.
    Use some damn common sense, this discussion is getting dumb now.
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  40. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by mitachuk View Post
    Why are people equating "allow a boy to wear a dress" with "let the kids run wild and rule the house".
    Because one of the big arguments being put up in favor of it is "Let the kids do what they want." The thing is, making kids happy is not the primary responsibility of parents.

    If the kid is old enough to think it through, and has had the potential consequences explained to them, that's one thing; suggesting a carte blanche "do whatever you like" is another entirely (and saying that very young children should be allowed to wear whatever they want certainly falls under that; they are not yet physically capable of critical thinking).


    As has been pointed out, there are other ways of saying "no" besides saying, "no, you horrible little monster, that's just sick". You do not have to say or imply that anything is wrong with the kid in order to say no to them. One of the simplest responses would be to simply tell them that you don't think they should do so until they are older; this is already used in plenty of other situations, and for perfectly good reason.

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